Legislature(1995 - 1996)
04/15/1996 02:00 PM House FIN
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* first hearing in first committee of referral
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+ teleconferenced
= bill was previously heard/scheduled
HOUSE BILL NO. 175
An Act relating to sport fish guides; and providing for
an effective date.
REPRESENTATIVE ALAN AUSTERMAN, sponsor of HB 175, spoke in
support of the legislation. He explained that the
legislation would register sport charter boat operators. He
reviewed the legislation by section:
* Section 1 requires a sport fish operator to
register.
* Section 2 sets the fees for a sport fish operator.
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* Section 3 makes catch records confidential within
the Department of Fish and Game.
* Section 4 establishes a two tier system of
registering operators. The first tier is a sport
fishing service operator licenses. This would be
a guide or lodge operator who has other guides
working underneath them. The second tier would be
the fishing guide who could also be an operator.
Representative Austerman noted that the reporting system is
covered on page 5. Penalties for noncompliance are also
established on page five. He stressed that the intent is to
provide data on the amount of fish caught in the sport fish
industry.
Representative Martin asked why not require a two year
license.
KEVIN DELANEY, DIRECTOR, SPORT FISH, DEPARTMENT OF FISH AND
GAME explained that the industry is dynamic. He recommended
annual licenses. Representative Austerman noted that
vendors can sell guide licenses.
In response to a question by Representative Martin, Co-Chair
Hanley clarified that individuals that guide for free do not
need a license.
Representative Martin expressed concern that out-of-state
individuals can become guides.
DENNIS WADE, HOMER testified via the teleconference network.
He spoke in support of the legislation. He testified in
favor of two year licenses. He suggested that sanctions
should be higher. He stated that there should be mandatory
punishment such as loss of license.
Mr. Delaney stated that the Department of Fish and Game
supports the legislation. He noted that the sport fish
industry is an important part of the State's recreational
and tourism industry. He stressed that the legislation
blends interests. He noted that the legislation is
supported by the Board of Fisheries.
Representative Brown referred to page 6, line 27. She asked
for further clarification of the language.
Mr. Delaney explained that there are two tiers. The first
tier would be the sport fish operators. They are the owners
of the businesses. They may or may not be the individuals
that accompany the clients in the field.
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(Tape Change, HFC 96-121, Side 1)
Mr. Delaney noted that an individual can be a sport fish
operator without being a guide or a guide without being a
sport fish operator. An individual cannot book the trip if
they are not a sport fish operator.
Representative Austerman explained that if a guide wants to
take people out on his boat he can get a license as an
operator so that he can book his own trips.
Representative Brown maintained that the language on page 6,
line 27 is not clear. Co-Chair Hanley noted that sport
fishing services do not include booking or other ancillary
services. Representative Austerman noted that the intent is
to eliminate out-of-state operators.
Mr. Delaney stated that a booking agent can be anywhere in
the world. A fishing guide is the person standing next to
the client in the field for hire. The operator is between
these two classes. They are the entity that sets up all the
logistics and handles the field operations but may not
actually accompany the client.
Mr. Delaney explained that outfitters are contained in the
sport fishing services operator definition.
Representative Brown suggested that page 6, line 27 should
be deleted. Representative Austerman noted that the sport
fishing service operator does not need to have a guide
license.
Representative Brown argued that the service itself does
include the activity for which a license is required.
Representative Austerman explained that if a sport service
operator has a guide license they can take clients out to
fish. He added that clients cannot deal directly with
guides. They must go through an operator.
Co-Chair Hanley summarized that individuals cannot not work
through a travel agency without an operator license.
Representative Austerman reiterated that the legislation
will require that guides work through an operator or be an
operator. He pointed out that there is no additional cost
to be a guide and operator. The majority of small charter
boat operators will be both.
In response to a question by Representative Grussendorf,
Representative Austerman clarified that an individual that
rents boats would not need to have an operator license
unless a guide is included with the boat rental.
Representative Mulder noted that operators are required to
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have insurance. Guides do not have insurance to cover
clients.
Co-Chair Hanley asked why operator licenses are needed. He
asked why the insurance and other requirements are not
placed on the guide. Representative Austerman stated that
the operator license is needed to cover lodge owners.
Representative Austerman explained that operators are
required to have insurance so that operations with several
guides can have one coverage for all guides.
Mr. Delaney explained that the purpose of separating the
person in the field from the business owner is to hold the
owners accountable for reporting. He stressed that it will
be more efficient to collect information from the service
operator.
In response to a question by Representative Martin, Mr.
Delaney noted that the guiding industry supports the
insurance requirement. Representative Martin questioned the
need for insurance.
Representative Austerman noted that there are requirements
for insurance, cardiopulmonary resuscitation training, and a
U.S. Coast Guard license to carry passengers for hire.
These were requested by the industry. He noted that the
insurance requirement was lowered from $500.0 to $300.0
thousand dollars. Representative Mulder observed that there
is a similar requirement for guiding on the Kenai River. He
stated that the level of coverage would cost approximately
$700 dollars a year. He noted that the Kenai River
Management Plan only covers the Kenai River. Discussion
ensued regarding six pack licenses.
Representative Kelly stressed that the legislation
accommodates two existing classes that were created in a
free market.
Representative Brown referred to the requirement for
confidentiality. Representative Austerman explained that
operators and guides are protective of the areas that they
use for their clients. They do not want others to know how
well an area is producing.
Representative Brown questioned if the confidentiality
requirements are too broad. Representative Mulder stressed
that guides know where other guides fish. Representative
Brown suggested that aggregate data could be released by
river.
Mr. Delaney noted that commercial fishing laws allow the
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release of aggregate numbers. He suggested that the
language be reviewed. He noted that release of data would
be on a fishery by fishery basis.
Representative Brown observed that page 2, line 3 could be
clarified as to what information would be kept confidential.
Co-Chair Hanley pointed out that there are some rivers that
only have one guide. Mr. Delaney was instructed to work
with the legal department on an amendment.
Representative Brown asked if the legislation limits who can
get a license. Representative Austerman replied that the
only restrictions are under the definition. It is not a
limited entry program.
Representative Mulder referred to the fiscal note. He asked
if all the positions requested would be needed. Mr. Delaney
spoke in support of the fiscal note. Representative Mulder
asked why two new biologist are needed. Mr. Delaney
observed that there is a one year statewide registration
that does not cover the mandatory reporting requirement.
Two positions are needed to comply with the provision to
compile information in season.
Representative Austerman questioned if the Department has
considered log books that could be compiled at the end of
the season. Mr. Delaney stated that log books would be
issued to operators. Operators would be required to keep
the log books current through the season. The Department
would collect the log books post season. He emphasized that
information will need to be sorted out.
Representative Mulder questioned if the North Pacific
Management Council considers the information in log books
verifiable.
DOUGLAS VINCENT-LANG, DEPARTMENT OF FISH AND GAME testified
that the North Pacific Management Council considers the
information in log books verifiable, but that they have
extended programs to verify the information.
Representative Mulder noted that he has an amendment to
delete the requirement for in-season log books. Mr. Delaney
stated that he did not object to the amendment. He stressed
that he did not want to leave the impression that someone
could get information in July on the number of guided
anglers in a specific area. He did not think the proposed
amendment would reduce the fiscal note.
Representative Mulder expressed concern that the program
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will cost more than the estimated program receipts. Mr.
Delaney stated that the season biologist's time could be
reduced by not being obligated to a statewide in-season
information system. This would make the program revenue
neutral. He pointed out that the fees go into the Fish and
Game Fund. He spoke in support of the program.
HB 175 was HELD in Committee for further consideration.
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